成人快手

"E-Clear and Halcyon Investments are two entirely separate entities.
The two companies operated independently".

Good work Douglas!

I would like to point out that oldnat and myself are "two entirely separate entities who operate independently" as well.

ha ha ha!

"Gotcha!" was never so apt.

I watch & wait with baited breath Douglas :)

Good detective work.

It is refreshing to see blog covering the very questions that are being asked by former flyglobespan employees for the last few days.

As a partner of one of the staff that has now the daunting prospect of looking for a flying job in a very 'skinny' market I have a lot of questions as to why flyglobespan were allowed to collapse.

I really hope that there is a full investigation into what has happened here. If we are to believe that there is some very shady practice going on with e clear and the so called investment from Halcyon, then I want to see some justice. I am deeply disapointed that the Scottish Executive sat back and did nothing - in fact did not even feel it important enough to speak about, a decision that our 'leader' Alex Salmond regrets - well regret will not help the 650 staff that have lost their jobs, the customers that have had their holidays ruined and may or many not ever see their money back. I also feel for the man that started this company, Tom Dalrymple. He may not be well liked or understood but this was HIS company and he started in the business when he was a very young man. I am sure he did not want this to happen and i hope that some justice is served for all of Globespan and it's customers.

I have personal experience of the wonderful staff that made up globespan. My husband had 5 very happy years working for the company and the loss will be felt for sometime. I have worked in aviation myself for a number of years and I really have never met a nicer bunch of people. People who believed in their company. We will take very happy memories with us, wherever that will be. Certainly won't be Scotland - nothing here now, and that is a crying shame. I feel like pointing the finger, but I don't know who at. Scotland has lost out on a great company (despite the grumbles of some customers and ex staff)and I hope that some answers are given over time as to why this was allowed to happen. I certainly hope that e clear are restricted from doing business in this country and investigated fully.

Well, where does this leave the great Scottish public? left with choices like ryanair, who am sure are chapping at the bit to fill globespan's shoes.

A sad week for Scotland - losing it's airline. I hope that someone is held accountable.

Mr Fraser - An excellent piece of journalism.Well done !


Please continue to chase this story.


Now you have shown that you can do it why don't you start investigating the corruption in a certain political party ?

well done mate, good show

Mr Fraser, this is precisely the kind of investigative journalism that Scotland needs more of. Something seems very fishy about this whole affair and searching questions should most definitely be asked. There may of course be perfectly innocent explanations for these questions, but where there is reasonable doubt keep on digging!

In one fell swoop Mr Fraser shows the latent journalistic skills that have lain dormant for so long.

A few hours ago I commended Douglas Fraser for highlighting this emerging scandal - I have no hesitation in doing so again.

Comment 4 says:
I am deeply disapointed that the Scottish Executive sat back and did nothing

The term is Scottish Government, and Alex Salmond is not your 'leader' as you put it. Such blatant use of traditional Unionist 'attack' language is unneccessary.

The Scottish Government were in talks with the company in September and were aware of the problem, however it was expected that this could be resolved. The issue raised by Douglas Fraser is completely outwith the remit and control of the Scottish Government.

Everyone feels for not just the passengers but the employees who have lost thir jobs - this ought not to be a party political matter.

No mention of flyGlobespan by Gray at FMQs.


"Is there any point to which you would wish to draw my attention?"
"To the curious incident of the dog in the night-time."
"The dog did nothing in the night-time."
"That was the curious incident," remarked Sherlock Holmes.

So Caroline, you will be leaving Scotland as there is nothing here now ? Well you can blame the Unionist voters for that, look across the North Sea to Norway and think what could have been,one of the rihest countrie in the world, with a $450 billion nation wealth fund set up in 1990, if cashed in today a cheque for 拢134,000 would be on the way to every man, woman and child in Norway......thanks Unionists

A lot of this was covered in the Guardian last week so its not really "new" news
Its all there and in greater detail and before the airline collasped (13th Dec).
I don't post much on these boards but I find it depressing that a people story like this, as with others, always ends up with the Nationalist versus Unionist argument.
I find it really sad that
a) people are out of a job and
b) the Scots now have less choice (again) on their ability to travel.

One thing I will agree is God help us if we are beholden to Ryan Air.

cheers

Comment 11

The first poster to make any references to the Unionist/Nationalist divide was comment number 4 who remarked that the 'Scottish Executive' sat back and did nothing.

The same poster sarcastically described Salmond as 'our leader'.

I reserve the right to repond to such comments, you appear to be suggesting that the comments should not be challenged or that the original comment ought not to have been made.

The constitutional debate is by far the most important debate Scotland has faced. Our choice is to remain relatively powerless and bob around like a cork in the ocean or to regain some/all currently devolved powers and take control of the tiller ourselves.

" Cabsandy" is correct. Guardian had the connection in detail almost a week ago......does nobody in the Scottish media, including 成人快手 Scotland, read the papers? I guess the answer is that we do not have much of a media left up here.

Good work Douglas

Isn't strange that that the CEO of E-Clear who witheld monies due to Glabespan, is also the CEO of Halcyon the Investment Group who were "in discussions" with Globespan about a refinancing package.
Looks like colusion and Halycon will pick up Globespan "on the cheap" from the Liquidator and put 拢20million in their pockets.
Surely the SFO should now get involved !

As a former employee of Flyglobespan, who has no job or xmas salary etc are you able to send me the contact details of Elias Elia? I have struggled to get them so far but would like to let him know mine and many other crews position personally! an email address or number would be great if you can send it to me

thanks

Comment 12. And I reserve the right to have my opinion. I was not posting for a political debate - quite frankly at a time like this (us having no job and the very real possibility of having to move out of the country where we live to find work) I could not give a flying monkey what you feel your right is to comment on my post.

Enjoy your Christmas in the full glow of your opinion and attack on mine. Our friends in the airline are reeling from this loss - we are in shock and quite frankly no one did anything to save this good airline. If we were a bank of course this would be a different story - so sir, I reserve the right to be pretty peeved off. Perhaps if you are in the same situation right now you have the 'right' to comment on my politics but if you were you would not have focused on that particular 'policical' aspect and would have been supporting the rest of the valid comments about the disgrace of this situation.

I think it is a shame that Caroline's understandable expressions of disappointment have been hijacked by someone with a political axe to grind. Caroline put forward a measured and heartfelt response to the difficult situation facing all of the Globespan staff.

Keep going Douglas, there's dirt here. The seediest side of capitalism.

It's a tale of two peoples, as ever. Chief executives and lead investor representatives swap privileged information - possibly between one side of a brain and another - to protect their own interests.

Meanwhile there is another class of people who never have access to all of the information - such as whether debt is insurable - which would enable them to make a qualified judgment about whether to provide unsecured advances to the likes of Globespan.

That class is always the little people, the mugs now trying to find their own way home and instantly being fleeced by the sharks who have arrived on the scene with fluffy sounding rescue fares that just happen to have doubled in price.

Five minutes with Mr Elia. That's all we ask. Just five minutes.

Comment 17.

Thank you.

Comment 18.

Wonder if we will ever find out the truth ? or even half of it? but I agree, 5 mins Mr Elia, 5 mins. Doubt we will get it though.

I wonder how many more businesses have a connection.

19. Caroline
"Wonder if we will ever find out the truth ? or even half of it? but I agree, 5 mins Mr Elia, 5 mins. Doubt we will get it though."

Try here for starters

#17

Caroline pointed blame at a political leader for the demise of her employer - someone rebuffed her.

They can both argue the toss about what caused this fiasco and you can fee free to join in.

Meanwhile - I'll simply state that there are rules about what governments can do to bail out faltering businesses - and in Flyglobespans case - it would have been deemed illegal by the european competition commission for a national (devolved or otherwise)government to subsidise an airline - even if it's function is to prevent it from falling to pieces.

Just ask Berlusconi and the Directors of Alitalia.



If anything, Online Ed's remark was that under the European Commission - the Scottish Government & the Westminster governments essentially have thier hands tied in attempting to help Globspan recover. Caroline perhaps didn't know this fact when she made her initial comment.

You might view it as a political axe to grind, many others see it as another dividend we accept as being citizens of a country we have no control over.

Caroline per

it look mr elia was trying to suffocate Globespan on one side and trying to offer help on the other, and may be trying to invest the same money he owe to Globespan, seeing his another "client" Allbury travel group gone bust and yet owned by himself. there is something very very fishy here.

on same eclear address there is another not a surprise eh..

looks like the pandora box has just opened.

scum like him need to be asked some serious questions and made answerable to people who suffered because of this. [Unsuitable/Broken URL removed by Moderator]

Comment 22.

Perhaps a trip to spec savers might be in order for you as despite re reading my post 15 times i cannot find anything that states Mr Salmond is responsible for the demise of Flyglobespan. Perhaps you should read this - there are further articles like this I could post. I would have thought that the loss of so many jobs would be of vital importance to our first minister and the rest of the cronies in attendance.

Gary Hay, thank you for your kind permission to 'argue a toss' about what caused this fiasco.

There is clearly something very wrong going on - the whole E-Clear business stinks of something and I do feel it is our government's (national - regional - whatever I don't care) responsibility to govern what business practice goes on. If a Scottish based airline is in trouble due to bad practice and needs investigation then I don't think I am expecting too much that Mr Salmond at least DISCUSS the problem.

Can I please ask anyone who has any political fight they want to take on, please leave it well away from me. I am quite sick of it.

Would seem that E-Clear have a past history albeit more than 4 years ago - found at .

Seems the gentleman (term used loosely) also has an old blog at listing alternative e-mail addresses, one of which is elielias@cytanet.com.cy, as well as many other business interests.

#24 Caroline

From the article you link to:

"None of the main opposition leaders questioned Alex Salmond during First Minister鈥檚 Question Time about the parent company of Flyglobespan going into administration, with the loss of up to 800 jobs.

A surprised Mr Salmond mentioned the omission himself after Iain Gray, Labour鈥檚 Holyrood leader, chose to ask him about a row over a political blog."

'If a Scottish based airline is in trouble due to bad practice and needs investigation then I don't think I am expecting too much that Mr Salmond at least DISCUSS the problem.'

I think your anger may be misdirected.

" I am deeply disapointed that the Scottish Executive sat back and did nothing - in fact did not even feel it important enough to speak about, a decision that our 'leader' Alex Salmond regrets - well regret will not help the 650 staff that have lost their jobs,"

Hmm!
So it ain't an attack on the man who was surprised that the ]
" opposition" did'nt mention it??

Sadly flyglobespan just is'nt alone in job losses and though it is obviously dreadful when it comes home to roost,unemployment is here to stay in the meantime.
One other point , I do believe it was Westminster who " saved " the banks , Scotland is after all too poor , too stupid and too incompetent to deal with its own affairs.

Caroline writes:
I am deeply disapointed that the Scottish Executive sat back and did nothing - in fact did not even feel it important enough to speak about, a decision that our 'leader' Alex Salmond regrets

Caroline then writes:
I would have thought that the loss of so many jobs would be of vital importance to our first minister and the rest of the cronies in attendance.

And finishes with:
Can I please ask anyone who has any political fight they want to take on, please leave it well away from me. I am quite sick of it.

I'm not going to address Caroline's remarks about the First Minister, I'll leave it to others to decide whether this poster is making it a political issue.

I am fully behind any inquiry into this collapse, over 500 people have lost their job. John Swinney has already labelled a disgrace the way the company funds were withheld by the clearing firm.

At FMQ's Alex Salmond basically implored the leaders of the opposition to at least acknowledge the serious nature of this collapse, he has now called for a full inquiry into what are at the very least queditonable goings on.

If something is amiss here then I would expect the Scottish Government to do everything in their power to mitigate the damage and suffering this collapse has caused and to bring those responsible to boot.

I am also certain that Iain Gray feels exactly the same way that we all do regarding this sorry state of affairs.

#24

It's "argue the toss" - as in the toss of a coin - the faces or sides of an arguement or outcome. Really, such a schoolgirl comprehension of what I said - I'm not overly surprised.

What you "misquoted" me as saying was inappropriate, inconcise and more to the point, potentially offensive. I believe you thought I was being vulgar with a crude reference to masturbation and that the outcome of Globespans demise is unimportant. You are wrong.

You, I'm afraid, brought up the political element in this Blog entry I'm afraid - if you didn't expect a rebuttal then you should have left it alone.

I was actually defending your right to say whatever you wish on the subject - not giving you consent. If you wish to attack me on a blog for pointing out the fairly obvious contradictions that stand then this forum - then get uppity about it I really think you should quit while you're ahead.

And for the record, my eyesight has been 20/20 since birth.

globespan actually made a profit this year, they were flying at almost 90% capacity, lets look at eclear. xl, zoom & are still being pursued by administrators of a eastern european budget carrier, allbury travel. globespan had issued a winding up order against eclear with respect to the funds owed to them. there seems only on company responsible for this mess. eclear

ps i am really sorry to see globespan go, i recently flew back from my winter break with them, their flights were comfortable (not like the big tour operators flying cattle trucks) they were local & im not now looking forward to 2 1/2 hour journeys developing into overnight stays down south

What were Globespan doing when near to collapse?

They surely didn't totally trust Elias Elia - the man 'strangling' their business by withholding revenue - to come riding to the rescue on a white charger.

Did Globespan think that Halcyon was a 'take it or leave it (and go bust)' option, the only show in town?

A 'good' PR company (and there are such things) could have been used to put public pressure on Elia's cartel.

I am pleased that the Scottish Government has spoken out, but dismayed that Brown, Darling and others at Westminster - some of whose constituents will have lost out - have opted to say nothing about the dubious dealings at the heart of Globespan's collapse.

Oh, and on a personal point, members of my family have flown Globespan in the past few months.

They were pleased to be supporting a Scottish company, and (like me) they are disgusted that the money they paid may never have reached Globespan - with part going to pay the wages of now-redundant staff.

SURELY the financial chicanery at the heart of eClear's practices cannot be lawful....

(With my future flight plans for early 2010 yet to be confirmed, I will ensure that I do NOT do business with any travel company who make use of the services of Mr Elia's businesses - even if that means avoiding international travel.)

Yeah, how that going to help employees / customers ! Unless it results in custodial sentences nothing makes a difference, NOTHING!

Gary Hay - seriously, stop trying to pick holes in everything i say and let this blog go back to what it is supposed to be. I really don't care what names you call me. Seriously I replaced 'the' with 'a' by mistake and you have read into it and stated a lot of nonsense. Let it go. You will feel better. Perhaps pour a glass of wine and spread some festive cheer. I have no gripe with you and did not start any of this. I don't know you from Adam and I really think that I have far more serious issues to worry me than what I meant in my original post. Have you never let off steam before? I applaud you for your level head and for well and truly putting me right.

Those people that paid 拢100 or more via their credit card are said to be protected.

However, is that only for credit cards that are on the FSA Register ?
Is that only if the receiving payment processor (in this E-Clear) are on the FSA Register ?
Perhaps the regulators should require UK sellers to use a payment processor that is on the FSA Register, and that payment processors be required to state which registers they are on.

Otherwise, there may be nothing to prevent E-Clear from walking away from its obligations.

Can someone please examine and explain ?

#35

No offense meant or intended.

You of course are right and I'll draw a line under it here and now.

I sincerely hope you and your co-workers find solutions to the challenges your facing this Xmas and that those who have instigated this debacle will face justice in whatever form it takes.

Merry Xmas

P.s. - I work offshore on an oil platform so no wine or festive cheer for me until I get home after Xmas - but I'll try not to be so belligerent until then ;-)

As an outsider looking in it seems to me sad that this seems to have degenerated into a political argument when perhaps it should be kept to the level of the business invloved.

There is another aviation story today that may have a longer term impact of flying from Scottish Airports.



If BAA don't have to sell one of either Glasgow or Edinburgh this will have a huge impact in preventing a "free" Scottish aviation market.

It is clear that Mr Elias has his finger in a number of pies, so to speak, in the aviation and holiday market and I am sure more will come out in the near future.

Douglas you need to keep digging as I am sure it will be worthwhile and perhaps the enquiry re Globespan needs to be widened to the whole "low cost sector".

There are a number of issues that need addressing and they become more critical as the choice of low cost flights narrows.

Dear Douglas,

This is excellent work (as others have said). As far as E Clear is concerned, this has all the elements of the Farepak scandal. The one where the recipients who gave the their cash for Christmas and trusted the company to give them the cash owed to them to pay for Christmas, only to find the money was neither ringfenced, nor present any more.

What Price Waterhouse Coopers did today was to demand E Trade had not siphoned off their funds.

E Clear are so far failing to do this. E Clear have signally failed to prove so far they are not Farepak Revisited. In my opinion, it is time for the serious fraud squad to be called in.

Blogs are hinting there might be questions to be asked of E Clear's last known bankers, The Royal Bank of Scotland. Maybe E Clear did ringfence their client cash, but RBS might have a different view because of difficulties elsewhere within E Clear?

The PR Agency resigned 24 hours after their appointment because they knew there was no defence to this Farepak view and were therefore in an impossible position. Plus they might not get paid. We do PR, and if this is the case we'd have done the same.

The plot thickens Douglas. I think you will find E-Clear aka Mr Elias Elia are Globespans main creditor thanks to their manipulation of an "insurance plan". Bottom line is, Elia is lining his pockets by busting airlines, so not only has he stitched up Globespan he's also running circles around the administrators who are powerless to touch him for what looks to me like daylight robbery. Elia has set up a web of offshore companies and "trusts" with the sole intention of robbing cash up-front enterprises, that's why E-clear

Most enlightening to find out how cashflow works - or doesnt work in the airline industry. Why does e-clear get so much business if they are witholding payments at that level? If a customer has a customer has a dispute - wouldnt they contact the airline, which would be liable - not eclear? After all this is the first time that most of us would have heard of the company.

I hope we can get to the bottom of what's going on here.

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

I am the ex President, founder, owner and the investor in 2000/01 of one million pounds of E-Clear. Elias 鈥渕anaged鈥� without a penny to 鈥渟teal鈥� my shares and destroys me financially.

I believe that in order to find out the real truth about the collapsed Flyglobespan and earlier collapses of other airlines related with E-Clear and to safe others to follow, the British Authorities have to examine the history of Elias Elia starting from the year 2000. They will be astonished to find out how the 鈥渕astermind鈥� Elias from a penniless person is handling now millions of money and the futures of companies. How he manages with big lies to come through every time? His tactics to achieve something are the same. He destroys somebody to climb up. The story is too long and it goes back in the year 2000.

Lately in Cyprus Elias was threatened with a bomb exploded at his house in Nicosia for money owned for years. He arranged to start paying with monthly instalments. Lately also was 鈥渇orced鈥� from 鈥渟pecial money collectors鈥� to pay with monthly instalments 120,000 from the total of 200,000 owned to a person from the year 2002.

If the Authorities take the matter seriously and dig deeply they will find many things. They must bare in mind that Elias is very talent to manipulate matters and unless he is forced to the limits he will not talk.

It all sounds very dodgy to me indeed. Its a shame for all the people who have now lost jobs, flights (thus holidays) because one Credit Card company won't over cash that doesn't even belong to them. Pretty appauling really.

Fortunately I booked my christmas with bmi and flyed from London to see my family over in Ireland. Went extremely smoothly and I can't fault it.