Ooh, I know!
It's worse than you think. That was about the state of the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office this morning.
It is what I call the Sybil Fawlty defence (for those too young to remember Fawlty Towers, Sybil Fawlty used to say "ooh I know" whenever told any piece of dreadful news).
The new home secretary described Britain's immigration system as "not fit for purpose" before going on to say "there are huge obstacles to that, if you don't have a system that is computerised, if you don't have identification , if you don't know the number here, if you don't know the number leaving".
The great political merit of this is that whatever embarrassing story now emerges he can, like Sybil, say "I know… dreadful isn't it?"
I'm 
Comments
Sounds like political manoeuvring to pick up on ID cards where Charles Clarke left off. Call me cynical if you like, but a computerised system where everyone has an ID and the government knows where they are is exactly that.
Not that the 'illegal' immigrants would let the government know they were here anyway.
Nick,
He could do little else! I admire him for being truthful, its a new experience for New Labour!!!.
I respect anyone who holds their hands up and accepts the truth when its staring them in the face, the reality is that several past ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Secretaries must have know about it, did nothing, and dissembled on a huge scale. That is the real story about this awful mess, and the question now is whether its the same story in all the other areas of Government?
The thing is I am not entirely sure the public will laugh in quite the same way as if they were watching Fawlty Towers, if something goes wrong in the Department.
As Gordon Brown is keeping a low profile for all recent embarrassments, does that make him Manuel ("I know nothing!)?
Presumably Blair is Basil Fawlty ("Don't mention the war! I mentioned it once, I think I got away with it")
Don't knock this new home secretary Nick. I listened to ALL he had to say this morning to the select committe and this guy made a lot of sense to me to say he is only just 2 weeks into the job, he really surprised me with his grasp of detail. I wonder how the fool of an MP on this select committe, who represents Newbury would have coped if he was the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Secretary as he was the only one who appeared either not to be listening or did not have the intelligence to grasp what the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Secretary was saying. I hope the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office is left alone for a bit to try and correct these problems and not bogged down by headline hunting Editors or opposition MP's distracting Dr. Reid to score cheap political brownie points.
Why do you give any credit to this type of defence. Surely as a member of the cabinet he was fully aware of the depths to which the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office had sunk, and if he didn't, then it doesn't say much about his managerial skills.
Sohow many people work in the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office?
To be fair to Dr Reid, any senior business executive taking over a troubled department or company would be expected do exactly what he has - acknowledge the failings, highlight the areas which need attention and set out what he plans to do.
For too long Ministers have taken over troubled departments and, not wanting to upset the last incumbent, refused to accept there were any substantive problems which needed resolving.
Let's imagine for a second how that evidence session would run had Ruth Kelly or Patricia Hewitt been appointed ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Secretary.
Instead of a series of honest and forthright answers - the second in a week - the committee would have been told policy areas needed "clarifying" and that the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office is having it's "best year" in living memory.
Either we want problems fixed in which case we all need to stop pouncing every time a problem is acknowledged or we want Ministers too afraid to set out the facts for fear of the 'gaffe' word getting an airing.
Implicit within this defence must be that for nine years, his predecessors have not only failed to improve the situation, but hidden it. Ironically, had they been more open they might have got the public's support for an ID card.
Implicit within that is the conclusion that for nine years Tony must have done one of the following:
Any thoughts/opinions on that Nick?
Surely the story of the day isn't Reid's admission of the obvious but the revelation that Ministers attended an auction where the Labour party made 400 quid on an autographed copy of the inquiry into the death of a civil servant.
Doesn't this go to the very core of Labour's problem Nick? They have no decency left, no shame and no sense of mission other than to cling on.
What better way to weather the storm than to place your best stonewalling bully at the helm. Every response we'll get from Mr Reid will be a masterpiece of masonry only eclipsed by the house he sits in. I feel for the employees of the home office who will now have to deel with this persons attitude. What applicable skills does Mr Reid bring to the table? Is he experienced or educated to the correct standard to be employed in this department? So far all I've seen him do is to state the obvious!
What ever happened to Cabinet collective responsibilty? Surely over the last nine years all this has come up in one cabinet committe or more. Do they all sit dumb when it's another departments problems?
As First amongst equals what was Tony Blair doing to allow this department to lapse so much in its responsibilities.
Ant asked 'How many people work in the home office'. The answer, of course, is about half of them.
He says, "It's inadequate in terms of its scope, it's inadequate in terms of its information technology, leadership, management systems and processes"
and then goes on to say, "It's not my job to manage this department - it's my job to lead this department"
so does this mean that he's inadequate?
Sooner (I hope) or later, New Labour must run out of smoke and mirrors.
Its not really brave to admit that which has been rebounding off the walls of Westminster and the media for some time. Just an excuse to buy time until the next headlines come along.
Civil Servants do what they are told by their ministers, and we have been told over and over that Cabinet is a joined-up group. Therefore as a Cabinet Minister, Reid should have known that there was something wrong long ago.
Funny you should mention Sybil Fawlty Nick, the first thing that occured to me on hearing John Reid's comments was Basil on receiving a complaint about waiter Manuel:
"You think I don't know? I mean, you only have to eat here. We have to live with it. I had to pay his fare all the way from Barcelona, but you can't get the staff you see. It's a nightmare!"
As he walks off the dazed guest turns round to her husband and says "You were supposed to be complaining to *him*!"
Hello Nick, It seems to me that the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office is far too large a department for one man. Would we have these problems if we had a dedicated "minister for immigration"?
From a youth's point of view, admission to blame is an aspect of politics rarely seen. Evading culpability is more a politician's style. Thus, I am pleased that Reid has said what he has said although it is hard to see how he knew 'nothing' of the situation before he took the reins.
On the other hand, we should allow him a bit more time than two weeks to discover how he will change the situation... hopefully with some strong handed measures...
"Sohow many people work in the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office?"
Absolutely NONE!
I can now picture Charles Clarke standing before the commons saying "You all deserve an explanation, which Mr Reid will be happy to give you" after which Charles escapes in a laundry basket.
I fail to understand those strongly supporting this man. Apart from his 9 ministerial posts in 9 years and his strong support for his boss, what are his achievements? And where was he when the same predecessors he is criticising now were trying to cope with the job? What has he done so far?
He has moved an arrogant and incompetent Minister for immigration to become Minister for Police and replaced him with someone who only TWO WEEKS ago was being praised as the right man for the Police! Managing by crisis.
If the Board of a public sector organisation had let a business slide to such a shambles, the shareholders would not accept it. Why are the British public being so apathetic about the mis-management of the UK??
John Reid says the immigration system has "inadequate leadership". The ultimate leader is the Government, which determines immigration policy and high-level strategy.
Therefore, for once, I agree with John Reid
This is not a serious piece of political reporting, is it?
I would like to hear some proper insights on the problems with managing the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office, not some GCSE Politics comparison to Fawlty Towers.
Or am I misinterpreting the role of Political Editor?
John Reid sounds very well informed to anyone who knows little or nothing about the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office, its structure and function.
Anyone can sound as if they have grasped a picture to people who don't know what it is when he is bringing some rhetoric and little else. Labour has been in power for 9 years and now they notice the HO is 'dysfunctional'. Or have they merely noticed now they are coming to the point in the power cycle when they will be able to do nothing right? There is a real disconnect between the 'John'll fix it' routine espoused by the SoS and indeed the PM and the reality..long time, tired Government, achievements dwindling. Time for another round of blame the civil service..bless the public service for being such handy targets again. Does he mention the endless conflicting reforms, ridiculous targets, civil servants working until 0300 to move money from last weeks fashion initiative to this weeks while the SoS runs off to sleep with his girlfriend?
Its really sad that people still, after all this time, mistake Labour words for Labour action. The spell must still be working..most of us would love to know how.
There are many issues in the HO and it should have been reformed long ago. Instead we have a Correctional Service that sits atop existing structures because no one has the bottle to change them, an IND that is without direction because it has 10 things pulling it in 10 directions, a Police force over which the SoS has about as much say as he does over whether the sky is blue and a main HO that exists to follow the myriad demands of Ministers interested not in the causes of crime but the causes of headlines. Mr Reid is yet another spin doctor from Labour...people who believe the rhetoric will indeed get the HO they deserve.
It was revealed last week that National Insurance numbers are being issued to illegal immigrants, so no doubt ID cards would be given to them as well - at the tax payers' expense.
Doesn't your cliche sensor alert you when someone says 'fit for purpose?' What is tells you is that someone has been spending too much time with IT / management 'experts', and not enough time thinking for themselves.
Jonathan - indeed! There is something highly amusing about a government criticising its own past performance. Reminds me of Khrushchev and post-Stalin Russia - blame everything on your predecessor and hope that will do!
Nick,
Hands off Dr John! I'm sure he'll bring the same expertise he brought to the Iraq war whilst at the MOD to the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office. He was able to find all those nasty WMDs, so I'm sure he'll be able to find a few foriegn criminals. Oh wait, I might have made a mistake there. What next, not enough truncheons to go around for the police?
It's the education system that bothers me at the moment. What do I say when my 16 year old asks me "Dad, isn't the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Secretary in charge of the police?". "Yes" I reply. "Dad, didn't they find drugs in his house?". I wish I'd sent him to one of those new sport academies now.
The problem is, it's difficult to identify a Labour front bench politician who hasn't been tainted in some way. Blair's friends are fewer and fewer, so he can't afford to offend the old soldiers, but at the same time he's not going to get anywhere without any new blood with a clean record.
Just like Fawlty Towers - amusing as it is, it will have to come to an end sooner or later.
Maybe the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office needs someone to state the obvious to them. Even better is the realisation that he doesn't have the knowledge to micromanage the home office, something that appeared to be beyond a number of his predecessors. If he appoints the best people to run the sections and gives them the freedom to do their job without being bothered by new initiatives every day, then in my opinion he'll be doing his job well.
So what do you suggest he should do in the short term then Nick?
To continue the Fawlty Towers analogy, remeber that Basil accused Sybil of having the Mastermind specialist subject of "saying the bleedin' obvious"
This was the aim of the reshuffle afterall Nick- get rid of Charles Clarke and then we can admit all our problems- instead of saying all this, why don't they try actually doing something useful to tackle the problem- the home office is just a shambles and I dont see how it carry on trying to do such a large number of tsks so I think it is about time is split up
Does it really matter what Reid says or does..is he going to be at the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office long ? He is running out of jobs, only Foreign Secretary and the Chancellorship awaits ..heaven help us. My point is that when these
people are shifted from job to job how can they absorb what has to be done. McNulty fails in one job..boom he gets another without moving desks.
Can you imagine this happening in the
private sector. There is no stabilty
witness the hapless Hazel Blears
whose only claim to fame is defending
the indefensible and lying down
to take the blows for the PM.
It could be a lot worse Prescot.that
WOULD mean problems..or rather
a nightmare. So whatever Reid does
it aint gonna make any difference.
His track record says it all.Reid
is a bullyboy but bullying doesnt work.
Given that we’ve been told many times that the Cabinet takes collective responsibility the whole lot of them are responsible for the shambles that goes by the name of the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office.
Surely someone who sat at that table sometime in the last 9 years noticed that immigration patterns were changing. Did none of them think to ask a ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Secretary how he was handling it?
It beggar’s belief.
It's a ploy alright, but easily seen as one. I suppose another raft of laws will be passed to tighten things up, when all we really needed was action. ID cards? Don't make me laugh. Funny though, a few years back, immigration was seen as the topic to avoid for race relations sake. Now everyones on the bandwagon! It's not about clour at all.....ask those living on estates full of eastern europeans! It's simply about too many different people arriving too quickly. Society can't adjust quick enough. Illegal immigrants are now classed as citizens and given rights. Oh I know....how absurd!
Judging from the comments I've read, Blair has got away with it again. New ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Secretary....not his fault....just being honest...or not. But a change in ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Secretary doesn't alter the fact that Blair has presided over this fiasco for 9 years. The 3 previous incompetent incumbents were appointed by Blair. He must take ultimate responsibility. But, of course, he won't...and won't need to. Because he'll leave before the next election. The country had its chance at the last election. And he got away with it then- and that's why we're in this mess right now!
Reid didn't start the fire it was always burning when the spin was churning.
Sorry couldn't resist.
Occurs to me that Doctor Reid is just making sure we are aware that though the ship is already going down, it is not his fault if he fails to plug the holes.
On a more serious note I feel that somebody behind the scenes is trying to bring about a change of Government, why else does all this embarrassing material haemorrhage out so regularly in such a short space of time? My guess is that the faceless men in grey suits have been keeping their powder dry and are unleashing hell at a time when the Government has weakened - political euthanasia... is there a law against such things?
Nick, It's not Sybil this ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Secretary reminds me of, but Basil.
But in my view the government is more like Laurel and Hardy: 'Another fine mess'
A fine mess at the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office.
A fine mess in prisons.
A fine mess in hospitals.
A fine mess in schools and universities.
A fine mess in housing and water.
A fine mess in Iraq.
But unlike Sybil, Basil, Laurel and Hardy, I don't think it's very funny. Do you?
Problem-reaction-solution! ID cards. why else would a Labour minister admit a 'crisis' in a department they have been in charge of for nearly a decade.
They deliberately let this department run to ruin (creating a problem) so that when there is the outraged indignation (the expected reaction), 'here is the solution we created earlier', ID cards.
I've seen JR as the 'real' PM in waiting for quite a while now, surely this issue provides the ideal opportunity for him to either strengthen his position or...
Personally I hope it goes the right way - not that I necessarily agree with all of Mr Reid's views but wouldn't it be nice to have someone with a personality leading the Labour Party?
Comming next week , why the home office needs 4bn investment to lay the foundations of the electronic boarderb - is this really the way to justify another whitehall computer farce.
It's about time Ministers spent time in their offices sorting out problems with their very able civil servants rather than sitting in the House of Commons, eating and drinking in the House of Commons, greeting foreign dignitries, giving speeches, opening offices etc etc.
No wonder the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office is in a state.
Ever since Labour have been in power the civil servants would have been getting good appraisals by their line mangers, who would have been getting good appraials by their line managers etc etc all the way up the chain.
So how can he now retrospectivley say that they havn't been doing their jobs? This would then imply that their appraisal system the PRP plans that they all agree with their line managers and then sign off according to the departmental business objectives have all been done ficticiously.
Even J Dennon MP said that civil servants don't get sacked - although they should be.
As for all the other excuses about IT systems I believe the INDECS system has been in use since 1980 without the need for replacing until now? In fact it was the present government that stopped updating it by scrapping embarkation cards. I see a scapegoat coming.
Linking John Reid to Sybil Fawlty? Very clever, Nick, and extremely witty too - "read a lot of Oscar Wilde, do you?" as Basil once memorably asked of an annoying friend of his (who was also bald, as it happens). The only problem is, it's as glib and pointless as so much else that passes for political journalism these days. But wait. Yes, John Reid, Sybil Fawlty, the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office, Fawlty Towers: and that annoying little creep who keeps knocking Basil's story that Sybil really is ill in bed - and Nick Robinson
I really can't believe some of the comments here.
People often complain that politicians aren't truthful with us and yet here's a politician who admits to the failings of his department and goes on to pinpoint what needs to be done. And people still complain.
As someone who works in a local authority, I know that it is a politician's role to lead not to manage. That's why we have civil servants and local government officers to manage and carry out the policies set out by the politicians.
I really blame journos like you Nick who deliver their comments in sarcastic and withering tones that just breeds contempt for politicians. You should tell us the facts rather than force your biased opinions on us.
Go Dr John Reid! This guy is brilliant. Okay, admitting to all the sins of the department is a political ploy as described by Nick. But the speed at which Dr Reid has appreciated the depth of the mess in this mammoth department is impressive. I suppose it is something to do with his Ph.D in Economic History. He also understands that confession is good for the soul :-). Thanks Dr Reid, you are the living example that I did not waste my time studying for a Ph.D. Apparently, the Doctorate comes in handy when one is disarming opponents by burying the bad news - first.
Nick
The question to ask Dr Reid is what have his predecessors been doing to earn their salaries, expenses, grace and favour accommodation if the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office is in such a mess. Since 1945 there have been 23 ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Secretaries, with an average tenure of 2.5 years. Surely some of them must have had management, organisation or leadership skills. Obviously David Blunket and John Reid do not.
When will government ministers earn their lucrative packages and take responsibility for their portfolios, which includes the management of the civil servants who try to implement their policies.
"not fit for purpose" with "inadequate" leadership and management systems."
Is this the "Labour Party" or the "³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office" ?
John Reid playing games:
Classic game playing occurred today in the Commons vis-a-vis what is happening in the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office and this oft repeated phrase about which Nick Robinson has reminded us all. His connection between John Reid and Sybil Fawlty is brilliant and profound. Consider that this can also be seen as a variation of one of the games which Dr Eric Berne described in his 1960s book Games People Play. That game is called Ain't It Awful (AIA).
These games are quite complex and carry variations from person to person and situation to situation, but the essence of games is dishonest behaviour seeking to manipulate others for a payoff. Dr Berne describes one variation of AIA as: "In AIA the agent seeks injustices in order to complain about them to a third party, making a three-handed game: Aggressor, Victim, Confidant. AIA is played under the slogan "Misery Loves Company." The confidant is usually someone who also plays AIA." (Eric Berne, M.D., Games People Play: the Psychology of Human Relationships, Grove Press, New York, 1964, p 86)
John Reid is the Aggressor; John Denham and the Committee the Confidant; and the public along with some civil servants the Victim. "Ooh, I know" aka AIA has John Reid telling of injustices while complaining to the Committee so that they can all feel miserable together as the public continues to be victimised. What's the payoff? Evasion of accountabilty and responsibility at the very top.
The past has shown that all Reid is good at is pointing the finger of blame, preferably away from himself.
Incompetent and arrogant -
it is not a question of if, but when, the old Fumbler will be found out. This is as good a time as any.
By the way, Ray (#34), to the other 2 posts(Foreign Office and Chancellorship) that Reid can be promoted to, i.e.. after he has made an even bigger dog's dinner of the present ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office, you can also add that of Prime Ministerialship.
One has to laugh so as not to cry.
It is worthwhile downloading the full ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office organisational chart:
It just shows the whole complexity of the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office and why Charles Clarke said there were systematic failures within the structure when he was ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Secretary.
One thing that has amazed me out this recent ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office shambles is that the former permanent secretary at the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office Sir John Gieve was actually promoted. Does that not just sum up the culture of the Civil Service?
Is the solution taking the security brief away from the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office? (One of the few Tory policy's I'm aware of) Or is it creating a Justice Ministry and an Interior Ministry like they tend to have in mainland Europe. But both of these things are really cosmetic changes. It really does need the Prime Minister to stop interfering in the running of the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office. Allow John Reid to do the boring work of governing over the next 6 to 12 months. The worrying thing is that under a Gordon Brown led Government John Reid is unlikely to be in a high profile position according to most of the newspapers.
...and now for something completely different...a man with two Jags...
I can't believe a couple of comments knocking Nick for supposedly 'dumbing down'political journalism, by using Sybil Fawlty references.
Get a life, and get a sense of humour! It's his job to communicate ,and engage with people, in what is happening in the political landscape - in the face of growing disengagement and disinterest in our politicians from the nation.
People are turned off politics because too often those involved are, toffy nosed, and unrepresentative. I take it 'Disappointed (Comment 24), and Richard (45), would like to keep it that way - sounds like they fit right in.
The comparison with Fawlty Towers is apt but slightly inaccurate. Fawlty Towers, 12 episodes, endlessly repeated and still very funny. New Labour, 12 announcements, endlessly repeated and all complete failures.
What on earth does 'fit of purpose' mean? I heard Ming saying it a few weeks ago to cries of derision and I just thought he was having a senior moment. Now Reid is repeating it. I don't claim to an expert on English usage but surely that expression is lacking an article - like 'the' perhaps?
There's an old joke about a new minister. On his first day in the new job, his predecessor rings him up and says "I've left two envelopes in your desk. When things go horribly wrong and you can't see any way out, open the first envelope. The next time things go horribly wrong and you can't see any way out, open the second envelope."
Six months into the job, the minister experiences a great crisis. He opens the first envelope. The note inside says "Blame everything on me." He does this and the crisis passes.
Six months later again, and there is another crisis. The minister opens the second envelope. The note inside begins "Take two envelopes..."
How many ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office Officials does it take to change a light bulb?
None
No one noticed that the old one had gone nor knows if there are any new ones or where they might be.
No wonder they are all in the dark!
Any chance that the Education and Health ministers might be similarly candid?
If anything is not fit for purpose then they must be talking about the current Government!
I think Justin Rowles in his post(#9) encapsulates the situation very neatly. So many Labour Government Ministers have now been involved with the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office over such a long period of time and at all levels, that surely it is now time for this government to take collective responsibility?
It is an issue on which the Government should now 'Go to the country.'
It is not Labour's ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office, nor yet the Government's. It is ours. It is time for the people of the UK to decide on what principles it should be run and who has the skills to run it.
I do like the Sybil Fawlty link, lets just hope that John Reid doesn't
become like Basil and make a complete dogs of it all. JR needs now to start taking action and let's put a stop to all this spin and chit-chat, we have had the unfit and shambolic bit, a remarkable piece of truth telling. What the country wants to see now is a bit of Winston--"action this day", and a clearing of the Augean stable that has become the ³ÉÈË¿ìÊÖ Office and its associated agencies. I personally would like to see some heads rolling for the failures, certainly amongst the Civil Service, they may come out with some tantalising tid-bits in their defence. Equally it is high-time that someone within New Labour and an Ex-Minister paid the ultimate price and was thrown out and deselected. But, as yet, despite the rhetoric, no specific action plan has been unrolled and implemented. We are wasting time and that is of the essence as we all know.
Nick Saint - sounds like an alter ego for another Nick we know... Listen, I'm all for having politics served up as humour - god, someone like Boris Johnson has made a lot of money - sorry, political capital - out of turning serious issues into a stand-up routine and don't we all love him for it: who cares if there are precious few ideas behind the jokes? But don't you understand, Nick, the Fawlty Towers bit is - how shall I put it, a little laboured? Not very funny? Trying too hard to be amusing? The accusation isn't about dumbing down, it's about being reaching for an all too easy analogy that doesn't work: it's about being glib and obvious, Nick Saint (oh, go on, it's Nick Robinson, isn't it?)
Nick, several people have already menetioned John Reid's ramping up of collection of data from illegal immigrants, making them easier to be kept under control.
Surely, the whole point of illegal immigration is that many will enter the country with no intention of ever trying to enter the system. And they are likely to be successful in doing so.
The IND couldn't keep track of people because they couldn't collect data about them in the first place
Add the goings-on at CRB earlier in the week into the mix and you start to see the whole issue of the funadamental problems with the proposals for 'joined-up' identity management growing into an ever-larger elephant standing in the corner. Many in the IT industry disagree with both the proposals for ID management and the processes to be used for introducing it. At the same time some of our ilk are rubbing their hands in anticipation at the torrents of money that will slosh around the currently hopless IT contracting and procurement process that government use (just look at the specialist computing press, like Computing, to see the stories mount up). The longer things go on, the more risible they are becoming.
Hi Nick, (My first time here)
I have just watched your evening report into yet more revelations into the immigration fiasco. I must admit I have long believed that this whole nightmare has been expertly co-ordinated from the get go. How else was this government going to persuade a very sceptical public that ID cards were the only solution to this problem? It's no wonder we are turning into a Nation of conspiracy theorists, you couldn't dream up half of the stuff this lot have gotten away with. The real sadness is that we as citizens are about to lose one of the most fundamental freedoms here, and all on the back of lie.
I understand from Tony Blair the problems have existed for two decades?
So I suppose I would like to know
the competence of the people assigned
to the task of monitoring these departments and the competence of the person who put them in place?
And how many productive hours spent in testing the system?
Perhaps I would like to do as badly for those hours and money!!